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	<title>Comments on: Labour needs a leader that Leads for Women</title>
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	<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/</link>
	<description>Left Foot Forward is a political blog for progressives. We provide evidence-based analysis on British politics, news and policy developments.</description>
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		<title>By: Labour needs a leader to lead for women &#171;</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-67024</link>
		<dc:creator>Labour needs a leader to lead for women &#171;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Nov 2010 12:30:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-67024</guid>
		<description>[...] 13, 2010 by lead4women    Rachael Saunders has written a blog for Left Food Forward, arguing that Labour urgently needs a leader who will lead for women. Sadly, for many of us, the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 13, 2010 by lead4women    Rachael Saunders has written a blog for Left Food Forward, arguing that Labour urgently needs a leader who will lead for women. Sadly, for many of us, the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Lucas Parker</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-56592</link>
		<dc:creator>Lucas Parker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Sep 2010 18:09:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-56592</guid>
		<description>there are lots of women issues that are mostly related to relationships and family*.~</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>there are lots of women issues that are mostly related to relationships and family*.~</p>
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		<title>By: Helen</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30859</link>
		<dc:creator>Helen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 11:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30859</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;RT @JennyDuncan: RT @leftfootfwd: Labour needs a leader that Leads for Women http://bit.ly/cW5NYt&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">RT @JennyDuncan: RT @leftfootfwd: Labour needs a leader that Leads for Women <a href="http://bit.ly/cW5NYt" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/cW5NYt</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Jenny Duncan</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30854</link>
		<dc:creator>Jenny Duncan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 11:41:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30854</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;RT @leftfootfwd: Labour needs a leader that Leads for Women http://bit.ly/cW5NYt&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">RT @leftfootfwd: Labour needs a leader that Leads for Women <a href="http://bit.ly/cW5NYt" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/cW5NYt</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Mr. Sensible</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30791</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr. Sensible</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 21:06:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30791</guid>
		<description>Always happens, Jacquie!

I am going to sit on the fence on this, but I see the point that both you and Rachael are making.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Always happens, Jacquie!</p>
<p>I am going to sit on the fence on this, but I see the point that both you and Rachael are making.</p>
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		<title>By: ikeaddy</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30789</link>
		<dc:creator>ikeaddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 20:33:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30789</guid>
		<description>I think we are in  danger of missing the point here.  Diane&#039;s candidacy is a fantastic result for progressive politics – but the fact that she is a black woman is an added bonus in my view. Like Mr Sensible and the other contributors, I support measures such all-women shortlists, but let’s not kid ourselves that these measures will create a more progressive Party. To ensure that happens, I think we need a more fundamental democratisation of Labour.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we are in  danger of missing the point here.  Diane&#8217;s candidacy is a fantastic result for progressive politics – but the fact that she is a black woman is an added bonus in my view. Like Mr Sensible and the other contributors, I support measures such all-women shortlists, but let’s not kid ourselves that these measures will create a more progressive Party. To ensure that happens, I think we need a more fundamental democratisation of Labour.</p>
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		<title>By: Jacquie Martin</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30779</link>
		<dc:creator>Jacquie Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 19:05:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30779</guid>
		<description>Mr Sensible

You posted your last comment when I was drafting mine so I didn&#039;t see it. As I suspected you had an open mind.  Maybe when you consider the issues, you&#039;ll be persuaded.  It&#039;s just the meritocracy argument is always trotted out without any regard for the existing problems.

Diane is a very able candidate but as is always the case with women, there are so many comments on blogs referring to looks and tokenism etc.  Harriet faces the same prejudices and is regularly labelled as a man hater.  If we&#039;d actually made some serious progress over the last 40 years of supposed equality, we wouldn&#039;t have to run a gauntlet on women&#039;s issues - they&#039;d be mainstream.  

Equal representation in politics with the effect this has on formulating public policy, will mean women ultimately become accepted into the psyche as equals. Currently, we&#039;re nowhere close.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr Sensible</p>
<p>You posted your last comment when I was drafting mine so I didn&#8217;t see it. As I suspected you had an open mind.  Maybe when you consider the issues, you&#8217;ll be persuaded.  It&#8217;s just the meritocracy argument is always trotted out without any regard for the existing problems.</p>
<p>Diane is a very able candidate but as is always the case with women, there are so many comments on blogs referring to looks and tokenism etc.  Harriet faces the same prejudices and is regularly labelled as a man hater.  If we&#8217;d actually made some serious progress over the last 40 years of supposed equality, we wouldn&#8217;t have to run a gauntlet on women&#8217;s issues &#8211; they&#8217;d be mainstream.  </p>
<p>Equal representation in politics with the effect this has on formulating public policy, will mean women ultimately become accepted into the psyche as equals. Currently, we&#8217;re nowhere close.</p>
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		<title>By: Jacquie Martin</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30775</link>
		<dc:creator>Jacquie Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 17:32:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30775</guid>
		<description>Mr Sensible

Sorry to beat you up here - we agree on many things but I need to say this: 

What I find patronising is the continual recanting of the very-reasonable-sounding argument that all candidates should be selected on merit. This is a complicated long-standing problem and can&#039;t be dismissed in such simple terms.  

Treating disadvantaged groups as equal ignores existing inequality, which makes it a self-perpetuating situation. Opportunity will have been lost because of previous disadvantages or exclusion.  

I recently heard Andrew Neil condemn the merit only argument as without positive discrimination [in politics], nothing ever changes. Not someone I had ever considered a natural champion of women&#039;s rights - he soared in my estimation. 

Positive discrimination makes up for lost opportunity based on discriminatory practices. The US and Canada enshrined it in legislation years back, which is why you see more women in influential positions there than here.  It was absolutely essential in South Africa for true black equality. It simply accelerates achieving the goal. 

It&#039;s particularly important for older women in their 40s and 50s who have such a lot of life experience and practical knowledge, but don&#039;t have great CVs because of segregated employment or family roles. I&#039;ve recently signed up for a programme (heavily oversubscribed) aimed at increasing the numbers of women in public life by improving their skills and confidence.

Obviously with positive discrimination there will be accusations of unfairness and there will be some well-qualfified people who are passed over, but it will unlock potential and encourage diversity which is crucial for the Labour party if it wants to come back stronger with new ideas and broader appeal. 

It is, however, something about which the leadership needs to send out positive messages and not allow it to be seen as a sop. Numerical targets without promoting a cultural change won&#039;t work.  

Eventually, when women are commonplace in senior and high profile roles in politics and business, their presence won&#039;t provoke comment (I hope). 

I&#039;m only sorry I couldn&#039;t sign the letter as I left the Labour party when it stopped representing the working class.  Another problem it should be addressing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr Sensible</p>
<p>Sorry to beat you up here &#8211; we agree on many things but I need to say this: </p>
<p>What I find patronising is the continual recanting of the very-reasonable-sounding argument that all candidates should be selected on merit. This is a complicated long-standing problem and can&#8217;t be dismissed in such simple terms.  </p>
<p>Treating disadvantaged groups as equal ignores existing inequality, which makes it a self-perpetuating situation. Opportunity will have been lost because of previous disadvantages or exclusion.  </p>
<p>I recently heard Andrew Neil condemn the merit only argument as without positive discrimination [in politics], nothing ever changes. Not someone I had ever considered a natural champion of women&#8217;s rights &#8211; he soared in my estimation. </p>
<p>Positive discrimination makes up for lost opportunity based on discriminatory practices. The US and Canada enshrined it in legislation years back, which is why you see more women in influential positions there than here.  It was absolutely essential in South Africa for true black equality. It simply accelerates achieving the goal. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s particularly important for older women in their 40s and 50s who have such a lot of life experience and practical knowledge, but don&#8217;t have great CVs because of segregated employment or family roles. I&#8217;ve recently signed up for a programme (heavily oversubscribed) aimed at increasing the numbers of women in public life by improving their skills and confidence.</p>
<p>Obviously with positive discrimination there will be accusations of unfairness and there will be some well-qualfified people who are passed over, but it will unlock potential and encourage diversity which is crucial for the Labour party if it wants to come back stronger with new ideas and broader appeal. </p>
<p>It is, however, something about which the leadership needs to send out positive messages and not allow it to be seen as a sop. Numerical targets without promoting a cultural change won&#8217;t work.  </p>
<p>Eventually, when women are commonplace in senior and high profile roles in politics and business, their presence won&#8217;t provoke comment (I hope). </p>
<p>I&#8217;m only sorry I couldn&#8217;t sign the letter as I left the Labour party when it stopped representing the working class.  Another problem it should be addressing.</p>
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		<title>By: Mr. Sensible</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30769</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr. Sensible</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 17:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30769</guid>
		<description>You might have a point, Rachael. 

I&#039;m in 2 minds on this one. 

 I think having Ms Abbot in the contest will bring a new dimention to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You might have a point, Rachael. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m in 2 minds on this one. </p>
<p> I think having Ms Abbot in the contest will bring a new dimention to it.</p>
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		<title>By: mike</title>
		<link>http://www.leftfootforward.org/2010/06/labour-needs-a-leader-that-leads-for-women/comment-page-1/#comment-30766</link>
		<dc:creator>mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 16:54:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leftfootforward.org/?p=14609#comment-30766</guid>
		<description>Compass Conference
Just wages: the case for tackling inequality session was brilliant</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Compass Conference<br />
Just wages: the case for tackling inequality session was brilliant</p>
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