The madness of Ken’s attack on Obama

ken Livingston calls obama a mobster over #obl – even left foot forward is coming out against him http://bit.ly/iBiwyV – #no2ken

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama: http://bit.ly/jzmQaX by @ShamikDas

RT @braunold: ken Livingston calls obama a mobster over #obl – even left foot forward is coming out against him http://bit.ly/iBiwyV – # …

The madness of Ken Livingstone's attack on Obama- http://bit.ly/mtkLSA Will the former Mayor meet the President next month?

RT @eljmayes: The madness of Ken Livingstone's attack on Obama- http://bit.ly/mtkLSA Will the former Mayor meet the President next month?

RT @eljmayes: The madness of Ken Livingstone's attack on Obama- http://bit.ly/mtkLSA Will the former Mayor meet the President next month?

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama: http://bit.ly/jzmQaX by @ShamikDas

Great piece by @shamikdad on @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

Great piece by @shamikdas on @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

Mayor candidate Ken Livingstone on Obama: "mobster" RT @leftfootfwd The madness of Ken's attack on Obama: http://bit.ly/jzmQaX by @ShamikDas

Another bollocking 4 Ken @leftfootfwd: http://www.leftfootforward.org/2011/05/ken-livingstone-barack-obama-osama-bin-laden-mobster/

RT @DaveHill: Another bollocking 4 Ken @leftfootfwd: http://www.leftfootforward.org/2011/05/ken-livingstone-barack-obama-osama-bin-laden …

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama: http://bit.ly/jzmQaX by @ShamikDas

Hugo Chavez's man in London does it again: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://ow.ly/4MZXU

RT @alekboyd: Hugo Chavez's man in London does it again: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://ow.ly/4MZXU

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

Ken should have listened to Mark Twain’s advice: “It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt. ”

Next time Ken, don’t make a comment or you’ll show how detached from reality you really are…

Coming from a man who says the Godfather is his fave book, I suppose he should know.

Regardless of whether you agree or not with Obama’s action, why on earth does Ken need to pronounce on this issue, or the cringey Vietnam War references on Question Time a few weeks back – his job is to run for Mayor of London, not Foreign Secretary.

I’m afraid it just makes him look quirky and an old-school politico.

And all this from a man who used to invite the IRA around for cups of tea.

Well, we all know that Obama hates the Constitution and the rule of law, although it’s a bit rich coming from Ken.

For once, Ken is right.

Is it too late for Oona to run? Sigh… RT @marieloewe RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://t.co/dJdiZnF

[...] 1: Ken Livinstone doesn’t seem too pleased at bin Laden’s demise either: ““I just looked at [the scenes of jubilation in the US] and realised that it would increase [...]

But ken is right, one think ton take Osama put him in court and the hang him electrocute him, but what is the difference between people who do not see courts or the law as needed. We have people in camps in the UK locked up all day for what being here, even children, in America you can spend a life time locked up if your called a terrorist, Blair and Brown would have loved to do the same, a killer is a killer murder is murder once you step out side the law.

How the hell can you say to somebody we love democracy when you do not hold it close enough to allow courts to decide.

I agree with Ken. Not only that Ken DID NOT say Obama was a mobster… he said the action made him look like a mobster. Important distinction. Quoting Greg Hands approvingly is simply gormless. Ken’s “extreme views” do not damage London at all, nor do they damage London business.

Also calling Ken’s views “madness” is sub-Sun level. Grow up.

Ken is an idiot. I used to quite like him, but foolish comments like this make me wonder if Labour have made a fatal mistake in re-selecting him.

Many thanks for the comments. Modernity, Theo, James, Henry – wise words. Benjamin, my article does not say that Ken said Obama was a mobster. And thanks for your other remarks, always a pleasure.

Sorry, I’m with Ken on this. If you affect to respect the rule of law, you put people on trial for their wrongdoings, you do not shoot them while they’re unarmed. This may well have been the action of the soldiers on the ground, rather than directly ordered by Obama, but, as C-in-C, he still carries the responsibility. The full text of the quote from the Standard is inarguable, in my opinion.

Ken so often falls to the level of the sixth form debating society, calling Obama a mobster is not worthy of the Mayor of London. His choice of friends is also poor, London is a great city, Ken unfortunately is not great, not even OK.
The point about the obscenity of celebrating the death is a good one though.

Why are you so determined to crucify Ken over this? His great virtue has always been that he tells things the way he sees them, and answers the question put to him. Is that a bad thing?

As far as your mealy-mouthed endorsement of him as ‘the most likely progressive candidate to win’ goes, surely you should be acknowledging that in policy terms- housing, transport, infrastructure, sustainability- he’s always been way ahead of the curve, and decades ahead of New Labour. The policies that Ed Milliband ends up with are likely to look a lot like the ones Ken’s been advocating in London for years. He is a genuinely visionary politician- a class Labour isn’t exactly overburdened with. Would you really prefer someone totally vacuous, purely because they never spoke uncomfortable truths?

@Aaron__Hill http://bit.ly/iBiwyV

@madeirakira this: http://bit.ly/iBiwyV. @Aaron__Hill is spot on, he can be such a prat sometimes!

[...] Even those on Ken’s own side have fiercely criticised his comments. Over at the Left Foot Forward blog, they’ve said: [...]

Execution without a fair trial is not justice. That is something I once thought this country believed in. But sadly after reading a lot of main stream press and readers comments it seems this is no longer the case.

You elected him, by 2 to 1. Ken is no different now from the way hes been for the last 3 decades, its a bit late to complain.

Ken is right. This is yet another example of America’s irresponsible and dangerous superiority complex. I’m relieved that we have at least one politician who will stand up against Obama’s actions and condemn America’s disgusting response to the situation. Obama has made the world a more dangerous place when he could have sent a powerful message – a figurehead will still be a figurehead after death; nothing has been achieved.

Ken Livingstone's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/jK8IQe

The madness of Ken's attack on Obama: But ken is right, one think ton take Osama put him in court and the hang h… http://bit.ly/itbi86

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

It’s not really a question of public “perception”, is it? Ken Livingstone *is* in league with Islamists and he *is* soft on Islamic extremism. His natural home would be in bed with Galloway.

What a nasty and divisive piece this is. Look at what Ken said, how can anyone disagree? I’m a great Obama fan but the American celebrations were inappropriate. Of course this action increases risk for Londoners. Ken’s speeches after 7/7 bombings were real political leadership, this comment is just cheap. The fact you quote Greg hands to support your point says it all.

Perhaps Ken would have liked to have gone into Bin Ladin’s compound and invited him to surrender to arrest. Or perhaps not.

Ken has a point about trials etc. In an ideal world …..

After seeing the initial news stories I asked myself Why didn’t they take him alive and spirit him away – information he would have held etc. I would assume that would have been a major objective, for no matter what they already had, surely he would be a major prize of intelligence.

As the various stories emerge, there is one answer that suggests itself, and it would answer Ken’s question. Suppose you have mission objectives which include ‘take him alive if you can and bring him out’. Suppose they do take him alive, and hold him. But as the fire-fight continues, the chances for that to happen diminish seriously. You not only have his men there to contend with, but also the proximity of the Pakistani military academy, and the questions there are very apposite in this case – would they intervene in effect to save Osama? So, as time ticks by, the chances of getting him out alive drop sharply. The quandary is that you cannot leave him there alive. Hence an order to kill in that eventuality. This would perhaps lend credence to the story of his daughter that he was held then killed. But Ken and others need also to take on board that he was being sought as the head of a quasi-military force, these guys were not out to serve an arrest warrant. This was combat. Here is the enemy commander-in-chief, this is combat. The rules are clear enough in that situation – if you can’t get him away alive, execution is the alternative.

So Ken can forget the rule of law argument, this is about rules of engagement, pure and simple.

Many Americans, by the way, also are not celebrating, especially victim families. Perhaps ‘grim satisfaction’ might be appropriate?

I don’t agree with Ken’s comment but I do worry about a powerful leader who takes 5 days to decide whether or not to publish a picture. How long does it take him to make important decisions?

Ken is an extremist. Always has been, always will be. He hid it quite well for a few years (1999-2008) by largely avoiding Dave Spart-style comments like this but now he’s getting old and can’t help himself.

I’m repeating myself, but I’m still baffled why there is so much islamophilia from the liberals and on the left.
Saying that Islam is a religion and muslims deserve to be respected like others-I should insist on like, to mean not more than- is one thing, and a good one.
But at the same time it’s high time for the progressives to open their eyes on the total incompatibility between Islam(ism) as a political force -and this goes way beyond extremist zealots and terrorists such as Bin Laden- and the values of our democracies.

Sorry, but this is just a hack job on Livingstone, the attack is only “ill-judged” in your eyes, the brutal slaughter of Osama bin Laden shows the west isn’t any better then the Islamic fundamentalists and Ken was right to point this out.

Unsubscribing…

So basically, you don’t like Ken and nor does your mate. Pwoppa nawty Ken disses the Sainted Obama. Look, if you want a return to New Labour values, at least do us the courtesy of removing the word ‘Left’ from your title. Oh, and Obama has been an utter travesty of a President, all bullshit and pandering. Grow up.

Must read is Left Foot Forward's "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja

RT @GregHands: Must read is Left Foot Forward's "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja

RT @GregHands: Must read is Left Foot Forward's "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja

"The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" by @LeftFootFwd http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja via @GregHands

RT @MustBeRead: "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" by @LeftFootFwd http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja via @GregHands

RT @MustBeRead: "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" by @LeftFootFwd http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja via @GregHands

RT @MustBeRead: "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" by @LeftFootFwd http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja via @GregHands

Was this article written with the approval of the Pentagon? Because it comes out with the same tired cliches accusing critics of the US president of extremism. A point was made the other day that although Bin Laden had blood of innocent civilians on his hands it pales into insignificance compared to the deaths of innocent civilians which successive US presidents were responsible for.

I disagree with Ken on most things and I deplore his association with extremists. However, his suggestion that Obama has behaved like a mobster is perfectly rational, and in my opinion, absolutely correct. Well done Ken.

RT @alekboyd: Hugo Chavez's man in London does it again: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://ow.ly/4MZXU

#Livingstone has totally lost the plot, there's being soft on extremism & there is plain nuts!!! http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

RT @WalaaIdris: #Livingstone has totally lost the plot, there's being soft on extremism & there is plain nuts!!! http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

Livingstone is a hoary old marxist who can’t break the habit of denigrating the US, regardless of the facts. Hugging a violently homophobic, anti-semitic, misogynist muslim is par for the course. Why the party selected this person for a 21st century election is beyond me. He’d be far happier tagging along with the seventh century prophet Galloway.

If people use the methods Mafia, then they deserve to be compared with them. We captured and put on trial the Nazis, who made OBL look like an innocent. This is a deeply stupid posting.

Correction: methods of the Mafia (or Murder Inc.)

e.g. ‘Tonight you sleep with the fishes.’

all progressives in the capital should vote Ken for first or second choice.

With Ken cosying up to the most reactionary homophobic, misogynistic and antisemitic elements of Islamism, why on earth would any “progressive” vote for him?

[...] what is disturbing is the alacrity of mainstream Labour bloggers, like Shamik Das in Left Foot Forward, andMark Ferguson on Labour List to wade in with the same criticisms, and indeed to give ammunition [...]

RT @MustBeRead: "The Madness of Livingstone's attack on Obama" by @LeftFootFwd http://tinyurl.com/5vup2ja via @GregHands

Frankly, it’s a shame that Das thinks Livingstone’s support of due process in international law is “extremism”. I thought the right to trial was a principle of judicial process in all democracies.

Basically, Das doesn’t like what Livingstone has – quite legitimately – said, so calls him an extremist. That’s not “evidence-based”, it’s just rhetoric dressed up as analysis. What’s more, it’s not even Das’s own rhetoric – he’s borrowed it almost entirely from Daniel Elton!

All this article does is encourage those who would otherwise vote for Livingstone to stay at home by tarring him with the same lazy slurs Islamophobic right-wingers do all the time.

If you believe in progressive politics, vote Ken livingstone in next year’s mayoral election. #yesweken

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama: http://bit.ly/jzmQaX by @ShamikDas

Why in the world can you lefties not come up with some new candidates? I am nearly 50 and this charlatin has been screwing with London my entire life. Get over him and find someone who isn’t a prick to represent your lefty views.

RT @leftfootfwd: The madness of Ken's attack on Obama http://bit.ly/mtkLSA

Sorry Shamik – but I’m with Ken entirely. I’m proud that Ken’s always been willing to “go against the grain so spectacularly”. But if anyone saw Paddy Ashdown’s case for legal justice on Question Time the other day, I’d think they’d say the case had been made pretty impressively.

Many people have been expressing the same sentiments as Ken – as we know, despite the fact that Obama has been considerably more sensitive than George W Bush – that when your enemy is terrorism, it simply cannot be right to stoop to their level and execute an unarmed individual – no matter how evil he is – in a foreign country. If we’re preaching Western standards, the least we can do is abide by them.

I also find it somewhat disturbing that Left Foot Forward is quoting a Tory MP – and an enthusiastic Johnson supporter at that – on the subject of “American businesses investing in London”. Pardon me, but I thought we had an ideology to consider, and weren’t just in politics to suck up to the Americans.

[...] like some sort of mobster.” For this, he was denounced by “moderate” Labour bloggers — “the madness of Ken’s attack on Obama” and “foolish Ken strikes again.” And yet today, Boris Johnson says pretty much the same [...]

[...] The madness of Ken’s attack on Obama (leftfootforward.org) [...]

[...] September 21, 2011 1. David Starkey warns adopting AV could send us back into the past.2. Shamik Das thinks Ken Livingstone has gone mad.3. Joe Murphy shows the brainchild of the AV baby posters.4. [...]

#LFFMostRead2011: #9. The madness of Ken’s attack on Obama: http://t.co/uQGmP6tV by @ShamikDas, May 4th

#LFFMostRead2011: #9. The madness of Ken’s attack on Obama: http://t.co/uQGmP6tV by @ShamikDas, May 4th

#LFFMostRead2011: #9. The madness of Ken’s attack on Obama: http://t.co/uQGmP6tV by @ShamikDas, May 4th